1. Welcome to ODwire.org, the largest and longest-running social network for eye care professionals, with over 20,000 ECP members!

    We offer private peer-to-peer discussions, articles, webinars, podcasts & more!

    Our site is free to all Optometrists, OD Students, Opticians, and Ophthalmologists, and practice administrators. Join us!

  2. *** CEwire2020 will be online LIVE on May 30 & 31 AND June 27 & 28
    63 LIVE COPE-Approved Credits! [REGISTER HERE] [COURSE SCHEDULE]
    Dismiss Notice

Gun Control: Where are Optometrists on National Issues?

Discussion in 'General Topics' started by Mike Cohen, Apr 17, 2007.

  1. Kent Juffer

    Kent Juffer Member

    955
    Messages
    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2007
    School/Org:
    Illinois College of Optometry
    City:
    Mason City
    State:
    IA
    The times have certainly changed ...

    My brother and I were carrying .22s by the age of 8 ... would never have even thought of pointing a gun at another person. Just about every boy in my 3rd grade class carried a pocket-knife .... for whittling or playing "stretch". Never, ever was there any incident with one boy threatening another - never even thought of it. My brother took his 12 gauge to shop class at high school ... carried it down the hallway without a case. The principal stopped him and said the next time you might want to put it in a case ... nobody dove for cover or called the SWAT team.
     
  2. Ken Elder

    Ken Elder ODwire.org Supporting Member

    16,626
    Messages
    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2003
    School/Org:
    SUNY College of Optometry
    City:
    Wallingford
    State:
    CT
    Whittling?? My God man.....did you vote for Calvin Coolidge in the last election?
    :eek:
     
  3. Kent Juffer

    Kent Juffer Member

    955
    Messages
    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2007
    School/Org:
    Illinois College of Optometry
    City:
    Mason City
    State:
    IA
    I forgot to add that after school me and my buddies would go down to the general store and get a pickle out of the barrel.
     
  4. Paul Farkas

    Paul Farkas Administrator

    71,799
    Messages
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2000
    School/Org:
    Columbia University / PCO
    City:
    Lake Oswego
    State:
    OR
    Time to visit some nations with strict gun laws

    Get your passport out and visit Canada, the United Kingdom,Ireland, Australia and New Zealand. There you can ask these citizens in English whether they have a police state.

    Then travel to the nations of the European Community. They Also have strict gun laws. Police state? I don't think so.
     
  5. Patrick Shorter O.D.

    Patrick Shorter O.D. Active Member

    1,482
    Messages
    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2006
    School/Org:
    SCO
    City:
    San Antonio
    State:
    TX
    And do they have the form of government as us, or do they have language identical in form or function to the 2nd Amendment in their Constitution?

    Travel is great. Go for it. But, no matter how hard you wish it, we are not France, England, Switzerland, Australia or any other country.

    So, as always, the question boils down to what freedoms are recognized and protected by our Constitution, and which ones aren't. We have a process to amend the Constitution, if it is that pressing and that universally needed, then by all means begin the proceedings. We are a nation under the rule of law, not a nation ruled by what a majority wants or needs or desires from our neighbors. So, whether you like it or not, as it stands our individual right to own and carry a firearm is still intact in this country and protected by the law, not quite as our founders intended, but at least not fully bastardized yet.

    I could give a rat's ass what they do in New Zealand, to be honest.
     
  6. Kristopher Glanville

    Kristopher Glanville Well-Known Member

    2,474
    Messages
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    School/Org:
    ICO
    City:
    Oregon
    State:
    WI
    I could ask them if they feel they live in a police state, but unless they have known the freedom of being a citizen of the USA, they really wouldn't know.

    If your freedoms have been oppressed for generations, how would you know any differently?

    I have traveled abroad and when I am in other countries, I have observed first hand a "police state." In fact, I had a rather unnerving encounter in Italy in 2002. Apparently my accented Italian pegged me as a threat to the military police at the airport. I was wisked aside at baggage claim for a little debriefing. It was cleared up quickly when I declared my US citizenship in English and showed my passport. All the Italians had a good laugh at my language skills and I wasn't too roughed up by the men with HK submachine guns pointed in my direction.

    Police state? It all boils down to your perception. I do think so....on this matter we will never see eye to eye.
     
  7. Ken Elder

    Ken Elder ODwire.org Supporting Member

    16,626
    Messages
    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2003
    School/Org:
    SUNY College of Optometry
    City:
    Wallingford
    State:
    CT
    Well, I grew up in Canada and I'm a US Citizen now and I can honestly say that I have never felt like I lived in a "police state" in either country. I have also been lucky enough (or unlucky enough) to have lived in a few different places in the middle east and it was much more of a police state there.
     
  8. Larry Greidinger

    Larry Greidinger ODwire.org Supporting Member

    6,998
    Messages
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    School/Org:
    Eyes Я Us
    City:
    Lawrenceville
    State:
    NJ
    Wow..check this out

    Never thought I'd see this.

    [yt]yTq2NEUlhDE[/yt]
     
  9. Greg Vickers

    Greg Vickers Active Member

    1,198
    Messages
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    School/Org:
    Illinois College of Optometry
    City:
    Minocqua
    State:
    WI
    handgun recommendation

    Those of you likeminded OD's that own or are thinking of owning a hand gun, I recommend checking out the Magnum Research mini desert eagle .45 cal. This is an Israeli made firearm and I'm really impressed with it's size and feel. I've been eyeing one at Gander Mountain for a month. Still haven't purchased it, but seriously considering. Just FYI
     
  10. Kristopher Glanville

    Kristopher Glanville Well-Known Member

    2,474
    Messages
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    School/Org:
    ICO
    City:
    Oregon
    State:
    WI
    I guess people in the UK are feeling oppressed concerning their freedoms and firearms after all.


    CGV,

    The "baby" eagles are well made, but don't fit my hand well, when it comes to .45 ACP's, I still think John Browning got it "right" in 1911. Better stop waffling or it may get banned.:D
     
  11. Greg Vickers

    Greg Vickers Active Member

    1,198
    Messages
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    School/Org:
    Illinois College of Optometry
    City:
    Minocqua
    State:
    WI
    CGV,

    The "baby" eagles are well made, but don't fit my hand well, when it comes to .45 ACP's, I still think John Browning got it "right" in 1911. Better stop waffling or it may get banned.:D[/quote]

    Kids.....need I say more?
     
  12. Paul Farkas

    Paul Farkas Administrator

    71,799
    Messages
    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2000
    School/Org:
    Columbia University / PCO
    City:
    Lake Oswego
    State:
    OR
    Guns don't kill people etc... really? Now this!

    First a minister was shot in an Illinois church Sunday. Only one killed because the gun jammed. Imagine, if the nut job had an automatic assault weapon.

    Yesterday more mayhem in Alabama as reported in the 3/11/09 edition of the New York Times...

    "Gunman Kills 10 in Alabama, Then Takes His Life

    By SHAILA DEWAN

    Published: March 10, 2009

    A gunman shot and killed at least 10 people, including several members of his family, on Tuesday afternoon in what officials said was the worst shooting in Alabama.

    The gunman led the police on a chase through Geneva County in southern Alabama, firing at officers before fatally shooting himself at a business where he was once employed, law enforcement officials said.

    Witnesses of the shootings and their aftermath described a man with multiple weapons who engaged in heavy gunfire, leaving behind blood-soaked porches and bodies.

    “It is truly one of the most horrific things that anyone in law enforcement can remember in Alabama,” said Col. J. Christopher Murphy, the director of the state’s Public Safety Department. “We’re still getting victims coming in.”

    The Associated Press quoted Robert Preachers, the coroner of Coffee County, just north of Geneva County, as identifying the gunman as Michael McLendon. Mr. Preachers said the man burned down the house of his mother, Lisa McLendon, in Kinston. Officials found the woman’s body inside the house, The AP said.

    “He started in his mother’s house,” Mr. Preachers said. “Then he went to Samson and he killed his granny and granddaddy and aunt and uncle. He cleaned his family out.”

    In Samson, four adults and a child were found shot to death at one residence and two people were found dead at two other homes, all shot on their porches, the authorities said.

    Another person was found dead at a business, Samson Pipe and Supply, and still another at a service station.

    A neighbor who would not give her name for publication said the gunman had also killed his girlfriend.

    “I heard pop, pop, pop, pop, and my daughter called me,” the woman said. “I’m sickly and old and she said, “Mother, lock your doors and stay inside.’ She said there’s a man on a rampage shooting.”

    Another victim was described by a neighbor, Koren Garcia, as a 23-year-old man who had two children and one on the way.

    He was walking down the street and stopped to talk to a neighbor as the gunman drove past, she said.

    The wife and baby of a sheriff’s deputy were also among the dead, said Sheriff Greg Ward of Geneva County. The mother and child were visiting neighbors when they were shot, he said.

    “I don’t know how we’re going to get through this,” Ms. Garcia said. “I have no idea. Nothing like this has ever happened. Everyone is crying.”

    Chased by the police, the gunman drove 12 miles to Geneva on Highway 52, then turned onto Highway 27.

    The Geneva County coroner, Max Motley, told the Dothan Eagle that he had been called to the Big Little Store on West Main Street in Samson, where he found the body of a woman between the gas pump and the front door. She was found face up with at least one fatal gunshot wound.

    Along the way, the gunman’s car was rammed by a police car, and the gunman fired two shots, narrowly missing the officer driving, said Mayor Wynnton Melton of Geneva, whose police officers were involved in the chase.

    The police tried to stop the gunman near a Wal-Mart store, where he shot Chief Frankie Lindsey of the Geneva Police Department, grazing his shoulder. The chief’s bulletproof vest protected him, officials said.

    When the gunman drove past a nearby grocery store, Sheriff Ward fired at him, officials said.

    The gunman continued on Highway 27 to Reliable Products, a metal fabricator, outside Geneva, where he was once employed, Sheriff Ward said.

    The sheriff said he did not know how recently the gunman had worked there. In the parking lot, the gunman fired about 30 rounds, officials said, then entered the building, where he fatally shot himself, the police said."

    Trymaine Lee and Dana Beyerle contributed reporting.
     
  13. Tory Moore

    Tory Moore Member

    697
    Messages
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    School/Org:
    University of Houston College of Optometry
    City:
    Dumas
    State:
    TX
    All the more reason to carry concealed.

    You gun control guys are nuts. These guys are already breaking all the laws already and you will never get rid of firearms if you outlaw them, just like drugs. I'm all for letting Instacheck check your mental records to keep wack jobs from buying firearms but they can buy them in a dark alley for a hundred bucks. Oh, but the ACLU says that's invasion of privacy.

    It is an evil world out there and all you can do is learn to be prepared to fight back and protect your family. The Israeli's now how to do it. It's our culture and it's going to get worse as all these wacked out kids that grew up on Grand Theft Auto and other violent video games can't deal with life in the worsening economy. There is no God, remember, so why not shoot people if I want?

    Come to Texas, I'll teach you awareness, tactics and how to shoot.
     
  14. Kristopher Glanville

    Kristopher Glanville Well-Known Member

    2,474
    Messages
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    School/Org:
    ICO
    City:
    Oregon
    State:
    WI
    You forgot to include the rampage in Germany, where 15(?) were killed.

    Remember they have VERY, VERY, VERY strict gun control laws in Germany.

    Was that why you forgot it Paul, or did you just not hear about it yet?

    And don't forget, it is 100% illegal for a regular citizen to own an automatic assault rifle.

    Sociopaths do not obey the laws!
     
  15. Kristopher Glanville

    Kristopher Glanville Well-Known Member

    2,474
    Messages
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    School/Org:
    ICO
    City:
    Oregon
    State:
    WI
    Scissors too!

    Foxnews.com

    PALATKA, Fla. — An 8-year-old boy was fatally stabbed with a pair of scissors also used to stab a police officer, Putnam County authorities said.
    Zachariah Williams, 20, attacked the officer as emergency medical personnel took the child to an ambulance, authorities said. The officer was stabbed in the cheek but able to use a Taser gun on Williams.
    Williams was arrested and charged with murder and aggravated battery with a deadly weapon.
    The boy, identified as 8-year-old DayQuone Hill, was pronounced dead at the hospital.
    The cause of the attacks was not immediately known.
    The attack happened at the College Arms apartment complex in Palatka on Tuesday night. Police said it is a "problematic address" for officers constantly responding to violent calls.
     
  16. Kristopher Glanville

    Kristopher Glanville Well-Known Member

    2,474
    Messages
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    School/Org:
    ICO
    City:
    Oregon
    State:
    WI
    And Bridges!

    Foxnews.com

    MOBILE, Ala. — An Alabama man who is charged with tossing his four children to their deaths from a coastal bridge last year withdrew his guilty plea Wednesday while a jury was being selected to hear the case against him
     
  17. Kristopher Glanville

    Kristopher Glanville Well-Known Member

    2,474
    Messages
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    School/Org:
    ICO
    City:
    Oregon
    State:
    WI
    And Drugs!

    CNN

    Toxicology reports showed that King died from a lethal combination of Xanax, an anti-depressant; and Opana, a narcotic painkiller, according to the Army statement. Investigators say they believe some of the pills King consumed were crushed and snorted, overriding their time-release design.
     
  18. Tory Moore

    Tory Moore Member

    697
    Messages
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    School/Org:
    University of Houston College of Optometry
    City:
    Dumas
    State:
    TX
    Face it Kristopher, they will never get it. The ones that call for more gun control most are the ones that either want power to control the masses (just like Hitler, Stalin, etc. ) or those that are scared of firearms since they have no familiarity with firearms and either too lazy or too big a pansy to take steps to protect themselves or their families. The police aren't going to be there for you and they will admit it.
     
  19. Kristopher Glanville

    Kristopher Glanville Well-Known Member

    2,474
    Messages
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    School/Org:
    ICO
    City:
    Oregon
    State:
    WI
    I know that some will never get it, but I am belligerent enough to keep it up.

    A news blurb concerning the Illinois shooter: Lyme disease

    "And now, the disease is being blamed for causing the mental illness of a man accused of gunning down a pastor Sunday at a suburban Illinois church." Fox News

    So, it wasn't the gun, but the mental illness caused by Lyme disease. I will sleep better knowing it was mental illness, and also because I have the old Remington 870 at the ready in case a post-Lyme disease psychotic enters my home without express written consent.
     
  20. Tory Moore

    Tory Moore Member

    697
    Messages
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    School/Org:
    University of Houston College of Optometry
    City:
    Dumas
    State:
    TX
    Anyone else notice there seems to be a high rate of "medication" (assuming anti-depressants) usage by these suicidal murderers?

    After my nephew committed suicide, we found out that there is a high rate of suicide in young men on anti-depressants, especially when the medication is stopped or the dosage suddenly changed.

    What if there was a link between anti-depressants and extreme violence and suicidal thoughts, exacerbated by stressful life events such as job loss, divorce, etc? Would the pharmaceutical companies want the public to know? Are they hiding something that they already know? Would they say anything?

    Perhaps someone should do a study on these people's medical records and see if there is a common link in their medications, specifically anti-depressant usage. After all, more people are on anti-depressants more than ever. When did anti-depressant pharmacology become acceptable and start to really be prescribed? About 40 years ago. Did we see as much violent killings back then. Not very many. I still believe that the loss of moral absolutes and angry, fatherless males growing up watching violent movies/tv/video games are also contributing to the increased violence in America.

    It just strikes me as odd that so many incidents included someone on "medications" and "they were recently depressed."